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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2020 9:16 am 
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Soft Roader

Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2016 8:25 am
Posts: 29
Location: Bulgaria
Car:: Xtrail
Model: 2.2 dci, T30, Manual
Year/Plate: 2005
Hello all,

Sorry if this is an old thread and i am "necrobumping" it, but:

1) Someone said that the 173hp x-trail is remapped 150hp x-trail. Norfolk Jim said he remapped his to 220. So that is 150hp x-trail remapped to 220. This is 50% more HP. Is that safe for the car and engine? And why didn`t Nissan tune it like that from the factory? Is this going to affect other parts of the car, like premature clutch wear, overheating, suspensions problems from the higher hp and torque? A car is a complex machine. A lot of components working in unison. Isn`t changing one part going to affect the others?

2) What about the automatic gearbox. Can it be tuned like that. Someone wrote that it`s map limit is 180hp. Is this limited in the software? What will happen if you remap automatic to 220? Why don`t Nissan offer 173hp with automatic? Maybe there is a reason for that.

Best regards.


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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:11 am 
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Xtrail Nut
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:09 pm
Posts: 2767
Location: Estonia
Car:: Xtrail
Model: T31 2.0dci auto, LE
Year/Plate: 2012
Colour: Grey
Mods: Towbar, ptc heater fix, probright drl system, Eberspächer aux FBH with GSM remote.
No1 reason is money, Like mercedes, and with trucks, maker can charge more money with the same engine. Volvo FHM 430/450/480 and so on. Same engine, different software.

The renault 2.0dci M9R engine is also 180 HP on Laguna GT.

The T31 2.0 dci auto is 150 hp because the gearbox, It can not handle torque over 400nm very well. It is designed to 350-360nm. Stock 150hp M9R is 320-330nm.
With the 150 hp manual I see no reason why no go to 220hp. The clutch will have more stress, but it depend how to use it. Drivers can destroy clutches on the 1.0 engines too.

I had mine remap to 180hp and 370nm, but at my own risk, but my butt dyno is happy. More faster and safer overtakes. With a mobile gps app i measured 11.5 sec to 100kmh before remap and 9 sec after the remap.
To ensure the autobox life, plan to change the oil every 60k kms

_________________
Sorry for my bad english.


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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:30 pm 
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Extreme Off Roader
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:32 am
Posts: 343
Location: Naarfolk
Car:: Xtrail
Model: 2.0dCi Tekna 173
Year/Plate: 2011
Colour: Ebisu Black
Mods: Nice full size mat in boot to stop dog sliding...and Celtic Remap 221hp!
Mine is a manual 2011 Tekna facelift which did have 173 hp. and was 158k miles.

My clutch was sound and also changed all shocks, gearbox transfer box and diff oils before having tune.

Tuning was done by very experienced specialist agent for Celtic. He first took car out for a run and then did a good check over including clutch pull in forward and reverse gears. He was very happy the car could take it and in any case Celtic state they do not go beyond the original cars capabilities which is why I went with them - They also provide a warranty on engine components should anything go bad after the tune. My car was connected to their system and copy of existing software uploaded to Celtic while they check it. Waited about 25 mins before the Celtic software was downloaded and then installed to car. Car was then run and tested by the garage and off I went on the honeymoon period..................... I have now done 12k miles and can say it has truly transformed the car in more ways than one.

I've found one of the biggest bonuses is as Ahto42 says is the ability to quickly and safely overtake without having to worry about which gear to chose. I never do traffic light starts as car is not designed for that but once rolling and in particular 3rd gear gently sqeeze accelerator and as soon as power starts to come in push down hard and boy does it move -it is very very rapid in 3rd, 4th, and 5th. Cruising in 6th gear is a gem as it will happily pull from 50mph up to whatever; many a time i have shocked a few Audi's or BMW's and my avarge fuel usage is quite a bit better than before and usually around mid to high 40's normal driving or 50+ on a run. The car had major service in Dec and garage found all perfectly fine.

I think that tells you the car can take it but not an Auto as the box would fall apart with the torque.

https://www.celtictuning.co.uk/services ... t3-content


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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:12 pm 
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Extreme Off Roader

Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:54 pm
Posts: 310
Location: East Hertfordshire
Car:: Xtrail
Model: Aventura Explorer diesel auto.
Year/Plate: 2008
Colour: Blue
That always surprises me, as autos are perfect for towing. I wouldn't tow with anything else. Why on earth did they use such a flimsy gearbox? It's not like there aren't much stronger ones out there. Auto boxes are used in huge vehicles and even railway locos at one time, and they could haul 1,000 tons.

Some years ago I remember Jaguar bringing out a new car which could only be had in auto form, as there wasn't a suitable manual box that could take the torque.


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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:51 pm 
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Extreme Off Roader
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Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2019 10:32 am
Posts: 343
Location: Naarfolk
Car:: Xtrail
Model: 2.0dCi Tekna 173
Year/Plate: 2011
Colour: Ebisu Black
Mods: Nice full size mat in boot to stop dog sliding...and Celtic Remap 221hp!
When I had Saab's I had a auto 2005 9-5 HOT Aero estate in auto and Hirsch who were the 'official' tuners would only take them up to 400 nm (still 300bhp) because they said anything over this would harm the gearbox. The manual however at 300hp was 430nm of torque - considerably more and boy did it go................. However I did question a Saab specialist tuner about this as the gearbox in the Volvo V70R 300 was exactly the same and that engine gave 400 nm yet Volvo tuners would take this up to 450 nm saying gearbox was safe............ he couldn't answer apart from the Saab was faster anyway.....


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 Post subject: Re: 173 bhp how do I know?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 30, 2020 6:25 pm 
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Extreme Off Roader

Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:54 pm
Posts: 310
Location: East Hertfordshire
Car:: Xtrail
Model: Aventura Explorer diesel auto.
Year/Plate: 2008
Colour: Blue
I often wonder just how much of this stuff is true about auto-boxes, even if manufacturers quote it. I once had a 1500 Mk2 Cortina automatic, and I often used to say that if my Cortina wouldn't pull it, it must be bolted to the ground. On one occasion (before people seemed to be worried about weight limits) I took my Cortina with a large trailer on the back to near Great Yarmouth to retrieve my friend's broken down Landrover. The Cortina was fitted with a Borg Warner 3 speed auto-box, and on the journey back to Kings Lynn it didn't even exceed the gearbox temperature. I had a temperature gauge fitted to the gearbox on advice from Borg Warner themselves, as I went to see them about using the car for towing. They said if it goes over a certain temperature just stop for 30 minutes and let it cool down. I can't remember now what temperature they said as it was decades ago, but it never went over it once, despite me putting it through torture pulling some ridiculous loads. I even tow-started an 8 ton coach across a yard with it. A manual 2 litre Mk3 Cortina wouldn't budge the coach, just giving off a dreadful smell of burning clutch.

Surely the torque that the engine is capable of delivering is less important than the load you put on it? An engine capable of delivering 400nm of torque would hardly ever use that much in normal driving. It might if you regularly pulled really heavy loads up steep hills, or if you were in the habit of flooring the accelerator every time you pulled away. Maybe manufacturers err on the side of caution with some of their ratings.


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