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 Post subject: Bull bars
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:37 pm 
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Does anyone know if stainless steel bull bars are legal in the uk, i have tried looking on google but all i could find is 'unsure sketchy comments'. Now am more confused than i was before i started looking into it.


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:44 pm 
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Mods: INSURERS WILL NOT ALLOW CHROME BUMPER BARS ! [TO PROTECT BUMPERS]
perfection69er wrote:
Does anyone know if stainless steel bull bars are legal in the uk, i have tried looking on google but all i could find is 'unsure sketchy comments'. Now am more confused than i was before i started looking into it.



"Hello perfection69er",

I posted the message below on a previous thread about `Bull Bars` - it might be some help to You in deciding whether to get Bull Bars / Nudge Bars:

The previous thread is here: viewtopic.php?f=14&t=5124


QUOTE:


I am NOT trying to be a `Killjoy` with these comments - I am just advising You to check with your Insurers:

Because I have had LOADS of occasions where People have Reversed into My Xtrail while Parking I wanted to Fit `Nudge Bars` to the Front and Back of My Xtrail.

A Friend advised Me to ask My Insurance Company about this - A Large - Well Known Company - They would NOT entertain this at all - `Unauthorised Modifications` - Nothing that I could explain would change their stance on this.

When it got closer to My Insurance Renewal Date I obtained about 5 `Reasonable Quotes` I contacted these Insurers by Telephone - NONE of them would `Allow` Me to become Insured with them if I fitted the Nudge Bars !

Again these were Large `Household Names` Insurance Companies - the lesser known Insurance Companies would have been Too Expensive with their Quotes for Me to even think about Insuring My Xtrail with them.

When I stated to ALL of these Insurance Companies that I see Vehicles with `Bullbar` Type Bars fitted EVERY DAY in London - some of them actually stated that `These People have probably NOT Informed their Insurers of these Modifications` and `May well find out that their Insurance would be Void in the event of an Accident`.

I also asked would the `Modifications` be acceptable If I had the Nudge Bars supplied and fitted by a Nissan Main Dealer Service Centre - using Original Nissan Parts [If Nissan do Nudge Bars ?] ? - The attitude from ALL that I asked was `Bars are Bars` - `We will NOT cover You if these are fitted - irrespective of WHO has fitted them`.


I just thought that I would mention this to You - perhaps you should check the attitude of your Insurers before purchasing the `A Bar` and `Rear Bars` - ?


I know that this Information WILL seem strange - Because I DO see `Bullbars` EVERY DAY even here in London - I really don`t know HOW People are Insuring their Vehicles with these fitted ?

I have NEVER had an Insurance Claim - So I have the `Highest No Claims Discount` that You can obtain - BUT it was never about the Premiums - NO Large Insurance Company would even entertain ANY Type of `Bars` !

I do know the `Safety Considerations` about Pedestrians and `Bars` fitted to Vehicles - But how do other People get Insured with Bars / `Bullbars` fitted ?

END OF QUOTE


Just in case You purchased some `Bars` and then found out that your Insurers would NOT Allow you to have these `Modifications` - I thought that I would let you know about the Attitude of ALL of the Insurers that I asked about fitting some `Nudge Bars`.

Regards,


Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:52 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 10:05 pm
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Location: Corby
Car:: Xtrail
Model: 2.2dci sport
Year/Plate: 54
Colour: Black
Mods: 7" nav, reversing camera, custom mats (aluminium chequer plate, custom dog guard (stainless steel), kenwood Bluetooth head unit
Cheers for the info, even though i hate myself for saying this due to the fact i think the xtrails look great with them on I think am going to have to give them a miss if it could mean a world of insurance nightmare in the future


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:25 pm 
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Location: LONDON
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Mods: INSURERS WILL NOT ALLOW CHROME BUMPER BARS ! [TO PROTECT BUMPERS]
perfection69er wrote:
Cheers for the info, even though i hate myself for saying this due to the fact i think the xtrails look great with them on I think am going to have to give them a miss if it could mean a world of insurance nightmare in the future



"Hello again perfection69er",

I would have liked to fit the Nudge Bars front and back - Just to protect My Xtrail`s Bumpers / Corners - My Xtrail has been `Hit` at least 30 - 40 times [!] - probably more - in the last Two and a half Years by people reversing their Cars / Vans into it when Parking.

I only use the Xtrail on a Sunday and I live in a Road which is VERY busy for Parking during Monday to Saturday - there is usually no one at Home during the Daytime to see these Parking `Hits` to the Car.

Friends who were working on the Roof of My Home confirmed My suspicion that what happens is that there are Small spaces often left adjacent to My Car - People try to Park next to it and only realise that the space is too small when they `Hit` / `Touch` the Xtrail`s Bumpers !

I have already had to replace the Rear Bumper at a cost of £540.00 because of damage caused by this `Problem` !


I was very irritated when I found out about the Insurers position on the Nudge Bars as I WILL have further damage to the Bumpers - the New one was `Marked` by someone driving a large Van into it [Forwards] within Weeks of it being fitted to the Car !

Even IF I could have found an Insurer who would `Allow` Me to fit the Bars - because most will NOT I would have felt `Tied` to that Insurer - up to a point having to accept their renewal Quote / Price - OR remove the Bars from the Xtrail - and obviously these Nudge Bars are NOT Cheap.

I had to install CCTV with a `Super Night Vision` Camera dedicated to where My Xtrail is usually Parked - although the Parking damage is primarily caused during the Daytime there have been other `Incidents`.

I recently had someone actually get completely underneath the Xtrail at about 10 PM - this is in a fairly busy South London Road which is used by People going to and from a Station - Bus Stops - Bars and Restaurants / Takeaways etc. - I am guessing that they were looking to remove a Catalytic Convertor !

I was extremely Lucky that I noticed this on the CCTV just as I was about to leave the room for a Shower - obviously I shouted out for them to get out from underneath the Car - I could not rush out and catch them as I was undressed.


I hope that My message about the Bars / Insurers has been helpful - but it might be worth asking Your Insurer about this - ?

Regards,

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:42 pm 
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Car:: X-Trail
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Mods: Reversing Sensors, Pioneer DEH-X8500DAB audio unit (replaced a previously installed Parrot MK6100 Handsfree), Kinetic DRA-6001 roof antenna
I wonder if the insurance companies attitude to these full frontal bars is because they are often referred to as motorcyclist (and children) killers.

Being hit by the great lump of metal during an accident rather than the designed softened/crumple areas will cause more injuries and possible fatalities.


Just a thought

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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:17 pm 
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I had to remove the side steps from mine as the insurance said policy would be void if I claimed and these were fitted. :frown:


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:28 pm 
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Location: LONDON
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Mods: INSURERS WILL NOT ALLOW CHROME BUMPER BARS ! [TO PROTECT BUMPERS]
Pict wrote:
I wonder if the insurance companies attitude to these full frontal bars is because they are often referred to as motorcyclist (and children) killers.

Being hit by the great lump of metal during an accident rather than the designed softened/crumple areas will cause more injuries and possible fatalities.


Just a thought


"Hello Pict",

You are undoubtedly correct in what You wrote about the Insurers attitude to `Bars` fitted to vehicles - but I suspect that it is more to do with the `Worse Damage` to Vehicles and their `Increased Repair Costs` than the Insurers concern about Worse Injury / Death to pedestrians / Motor Cyclists / Cyclists - although they would obviously claim [no pun intended] that `People were obviously of more concern`.

I am a fairly well educated Man and pride Myself on having a decent supply of Common Sense - I wonder if being `Hit` by an Xtrail with Nudge Bars would really constitute a FAR greater chance of very serious injury or Death - in comparison with being Hit by the Bumper / Front / Bonnet of the vehicle - even with Children - ?

I know the analogy about being `Hit by a 40mm Steel Bar` - but that would be at below the knee level for most Adults and above the knee level for most Children - only VERY small Children would be at Waist / Chest level with Nudge Bars.

Although there is some `Give` in the Resin components at the Front of the Xtrail / other 4X4`s / other Vehicles - most of the `Hit` to a person would be above Nudge Bars - to the Front of the Vehicle - obviously that would NOT apply to full Bull Bars.

That is what makes Me think that the Insurers attitude is because of the greater chance of MUCH more Damage to another Vehicle involved in a Collision with the Bars - ?

I was NOT trying to do anything particularly unusual in having `Nudge Bars` fitted to protect the Bumpers of My Xtrail [which even at that time had been damaged by people reversing into it many times] - in relation to the MANY Vehicles / 4X4`s that I see almost every Day in London - some of which have Full `Bull Bars` !

I am NOT making light of any Death or serious injury to people that Members may know about which was caused by `Bull Bars` or similar during a collision with a Vehicle.

Regards,

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 7:41 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:40 pm
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Location: LONDON
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Mods: INSURERS WILL NOT ALLOW CHROME BUMPER BARS ! [TO PROTECT BUMPERS]
cowboy wrote:
I had to remove the side steps from mine as the insurance said policy would be void if I claimed and these were fitted. :frown:



"Hello cowboy",

I have heard it all now ! - Where is the sense in that ?

The Insurers must be thinking that if a Vehicle collided with the SIDE of your Xtrail the Side Steps would cause more damage to that vehicle than if You did not have the Side Steps !

This MUST be collusion within the Insurance Industry to keep Repair Costs down - irrespective of who is at Fault in an Accident / Collision.

This business of `Unauthorised Modifications` is a minefield just waiting for anyone who has NOT checked with their Insurers before purchasing and fitting things such as Nudge Bars / Bull Bars / NOW - Side Steps etc. !

People WILL find that their Insurers use this as a reason to NOT Pay Out - and `God Help` the Driver and the Family of anyone who gets seriously Injured / Dies as a result of an Accident / Collision with a vehicle where the Insurer refuses to Pay Out because of an `Unauthorised Modification` !


I would advise any Member who has anything that could be classed as an `Unauthorised Modification` to check with their Insurers - YOU don`t want to find out AFTER an Accident that You are NOT Insured !


Regards,

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:21 pm 
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Car:: X-Trail
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CHRISM wrote:
I know the analogy about being `Hit by a 40mm Steel Bar` - but that would be at below the knee level for most Adults and above the knee level for most Children - only VERY small Children would be at Waist / Chest level with Nudge Bars.


I agree with your points re your nudge bars, to clarify I was thinking of the full size bull bars which go the full height of the front of the vehicle (and quite often are above the bonnet line).

These bars would be head height for children of varying ages

Regards
Rick

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 Post subject: Re: Bull bars
PostPosted: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:27 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:40 pm
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Location: LONDON
Car:: XTRAIL
Model: 2.0 SE PETROL MANUAL
Year/Plate: 2006 / 06
Colour: BLACK
Mods: INSURERS WILL NOT ALLOW CHROME BUMPER BARS ! [TO PROTECT BUMPERS]
Pict wrote:
CHRISM wrote:
I know the analogy about being `Hit by a 40mm Steel Bar` - but that would be at below the knee level for most Adults and above the knee level for most Children - only VERY small Children would be at Waist / Chest level with Nudge Bars.


I agree with your points re your nudge bars, to clarify I was thinking of the full size bull bars which go the full height of the front of the vehicle (and quite often are above the bonnet line).

These bars would be head height for children of varying ages

Regards
Rick


"Hello Pict / Rick",

Thanks for the reply.

I did think that You were primarily writing about full `Bull Bars` which would be extremely dangerous to People being `Hit` by them - obviously a completely different proposition to Nudge Bars in a collision with a Child or an Adult !

That is why I made a comment about what I wrote about the `Collision Heights` not being applicable to Bull Bars.

Regards,

Chris


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