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milton said:
@legfan. How much oil did you get for ÂŁ36 :biggrin:

@avocet was it this Fuchs Titan Supersyn ACEA A3/B4 API SN/SM/CF that you used :biggrin:

Thanks guys
Milton :thumbs:
Can't remember all the ACEA specs but it was certainly the supersyn stuff.
 
CHRISM said:
milton said:
Hi Chris
Did you supply the oil at the last service or is that what you asked Nissan to put in ?
Best regards
Milton :biggrin:
"Hello Milton",

The Castrol Magnatec was what the Nissan Main Dealer Service Centre decided was the most appropriate Engine Oil for My Xtrail [and obviously other Cars] at the last Service and they had this in stock in large Barrels.

Now the Dealership has changed hands so they now use Mobil Oils.

Since posting my previous message I looked for Mobil 5W 40 on the Halfords website - they do not have it - I then went to a Mobil Oils website where I found something like Mobil `Super 3000` 5W 40 which I think is a `top of the range` Engine Oil - there was no price on it as it was on the Mobil website.

I am now doubting that the Service Centre would be using this and I could not find a `standard` Mobil 5W 40 Oil - perhaps I misheard when I asked about this and they said 5W 30 ?

Using a couple of `Which Engine Oil for your Car` website Tools I found that they were either recommending a Mobil 15W 40 - OR a Mobil 0W 40 [!].

The Mobil 0W 40 seems to be for Newer Cars / Engines or `Good Engine` Older Cars.

Here is a link to thae Mobil webpage:

http://www.mobil.co.uk/UK-English-LCW/c ... -0w40.aspx

I know that I will have to get clarification from the Service Centre now - but obviously if they use anything other than a 5W 40 Fully Synthetic the Castrol Magnatec Professional B4 5W 40 that I have will NOT be compatible with it.

I wish that I had looked for `Mobil 5W 40` Engine Oil before posting my previous message where this doubt / possible error in hearing what was said about the Oil change would have come about.

The person that I was speaking to was a Servicing Department Reception representative so I could not ask for any opinion from them about the Mobil 5W 40 / Castrol 5W 40 compatibility.

Thanks for your interest Milton.

Regards,

Chris
"Hello All",

Further to my previous message above - the Engine Oil that was put into my Xtrail at the Oil change was `Nissan Oil` 5W/30 Fully Synthetic.

I put it to the Service Centre Servicing Manager why the `Nissan Servicing Experts` who previously owned the Dealership / Service Centre specified / used Castrol Magnatec Professional 5W/40 Fully Synthetic but the present `Nissan Servicing Experts` specify / use Nissan Oil 5W/30 Fully Synthetic ?

The answer was something along the lines of `As a Group we specify Nissan Oil 5W/30 because this is what Nissan specify`.

I still have about 1.9 Litres of Castrol Magnatec Professional 5W/40 as I have only used 100ml of it for a top up during the last 33 Months / 2600 Miles - I am fairly sure that the 2 Litres of this that I bought at the last Service cost close to ÂŁ30.00 - I take it that I should NOT mix this with the Nissan 5W/30 Oil for topping up ?

Regards,

Chris
 
Yeah, that's franchised main dealers for you! it's all about liability. If they use what Nissan specify, then regardless of whether it's better or worse for your engine, whatever happens, it won't be their fault if anything goes wrong. The 5W40 just has a slightly higher viscosity when hot than the 5W30. So when you're up to running temperature, as far as the engine is concerned, it will feel like the oil is a bit cooler than it really is. It will be slightly more viscous which will probably cost you another 0.00001 mile per gallon (or something miniscule). But they do run much smoother and quieter with the 40!

If you mix the two, I'm sure most people will suck air through their teeth and shake their heads, but personally, provided they're both fully synthetic and meet the required ACEA standards, I suspect you'll just end up with something like a 5W31 in there if you mix them. Personally, for the relatively trivial amount of money involved, I probably wouldn't do it in my own car, but I doubt anything bad will happen.

Might be worth e-mailing these chaps and getting their opinion:

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/c-681-car-engine-oils.aspx
 
Andy Shepherd said:
Hi Chris, just buy your own oil ( Castrol, Fuchs or whatever brand you want ) and Nissan will put it in for you, that way you can ensure that a good quality 5w-40 goes in the Xy.

Andy... :smile:
"Hello Andy",

Here is why it would not have occurred to Me that I should supply the Engine Oil to the Service Centre:

When I had the last Service at the Nissan Main Dealer Service Centre it was owned by a different Main Dealer Group - I asked at that time what Engine Oil they used and was told Castrol Magnatec Professional 5W/40 Fully Synthetic - I knew of this Oil and I was perfectly happy to have it put into my Xtrail`s engine.

Recently I received a letter from the New Main Dealer Group/ Owner of the Service Centre offering a `Value Service` [just Oil & Oil filter change] - including a Free MOT and a Year Membership to the RAC Breakdown Service which includes Recovery & Home start = ÂŁ109.00. -

I feel that this is great value for money for anyone who does not have a Breakdown Service as this cover from the AA is probably over ÂŁ150.00 per Year [?] - I don`t have Home Start so I do not know exactly - and value for money regarding the Oil & Oil Filter change plus MOT.

In that letter it stated that they would be using `Mobil premium quality engine Oil` - although I booked the Service - MOT - Caliper replacement etc. before seeing the comments about Mobil Oils on this thread I was quite happy to have Mobil Oil put into my Xtrail`s Engine [I thought 5W/40 grade].

I was asking about using the remainder of the Castrol Magnatec on here ONLY to find out whether I needed to purchase some of the New Oil for top ups in future - just in case I was told that the 5W-30 and 5W-40 are fully compatible - it was never my intention to try and use the Magnatec just so as to not lose the money that I paid for it unless I was reliably informed by Members that this would be O.K.

This is why I would not have asked either of the Main Dealer Service Centre operators / Servicing departments to allow Me to supply them with the Engine Oil of my choice.

Now I have had `Nissan Motor Oil - 5W-30 DPF` - Nissan Part No: KE900-90033 put in - [invoiced at ÂŁ47.88 inc vat.] I found this out at the time of checking the Invoice - I obviously asked about the Letter / special offer stating `Mobil Premium quality engine Oil` - they stated `We use Nissan specified Engine Oil - Genuine Nissan Oil` and always have done.

Obviously this put Me into a position of - be very awkward and argue the point to insist on Mobil Oil being put in - as I have the `Mobil Premium Engine Oil` in writing - or accept the `Nissan specified / Genuine Part Motor Oil`.

IF I had insisted on this I know that I would never be able to use them again as any Customer Loyalty / Customer Service that I have accrued by becoming familiar with the Servicing department Staff and some of the MOT Testers / Vehicle Engineers [Mechanics] would have been lost - my Xtrail would also have had to remain with them overnight.

The Service Centre that I use is 10 Miles away from my Home and a Cab to go there to collect the Car costs ÂŁ22.00 - so unless I was adamant that they had definitely done something detrimental to my Xtrail I would not really want to have spent another ÂŁ44.00 on a further 2 Cabs going Home and coming back again the next Day.

So Andy although I might get them to allow Me to supply Castrol Magnatec Professional 5W-40 Fully Synthetic Engine Oil when the next Service is carried out - it is too late now because of what I describe above.

If I have the Nissan Gold Fixed Price Service in a couple of Years time and I get them to agree that I supply Magnatec 5W-40 I cannot imagine that they will want to deduct anything like the ÂŁ47.88 that is showing on my Invoice for the Nissan Oil - they may not want to deduct anything from the `Nissan Fixed Price` as I think that they view these Nissan Gold Fixed Price Services as `too much work for very little profit`.

Sorry for the very long reply Andy but I wanted to explain that at no time between Me seeing the special offer of the `Value Service` [Oil & Filter change] - booking it and asking about the Oil to be put in was there a reason / opportunity to decide that I wanted to supply the Engine Oil.

Regards,

Chris
 
"Hello All",

As this thread is about the differences between 2 Grades of Engine Oil I wondered if any Members / Readers would be interested in this.

I hope that I am not breaching any Forum rules by posting this as it is fully available online and I am sure free to access and quote as I have done here by giving the Link to the original source.

Below is an article from `Simon the Oilman` at Opie Oils - posted on the `Honest John` website here:

http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/ ... tm?t=42671

explaining the MANY items of Engine Oil Labelling:

QUOTE:

What?s written on your oil bottle and what does it mean.

This post may seem like going back to basics but I am constantly surprised by the amount of people who do not know or understand what is written on a bottle of oil and therefore no idea of what they are buying/using.

To be blunt about the subject, if a bottle of oil does not contain the following basic information then DO NOT buy it look for something that does!

1) The purpose for which it is intended (i.e. Motor oil, Gear oil etc)

2) The viscosity (i.e. 10w-40, 5w-30 etc for Motor oils and 80w-90, 75w-90 etc for Gear oils)

3) The specifications that it meets (should contain both API and ACEA ratings)

4) The OEM Approvals that it carries and the codes (i.e. MB229.3, VW503.00, BMW LL01 etc)

Ignore the marketing blurb on the label it is in many cases meaningless and I will explain later what statements you should treat this with some scepticism

So, what does the above information mean and why is it important?

THE BASICS

All oils are intended for an application and in general are not interchangeable. You would not for example put an Automatic Transmission Oil or a Gear Oil in your engine! It is important to know what the oils intended purpose is.

VISCOSITY

Most oils on the shelves today are ?Multigrades?, which simply means that the oil falls into 2 viscosity grades (i.e. 10w-40 etc)

Multigrades were first developed some 50 years ago to avoid the old routine of using a thinner oil in winter and a thicker oil in summer.

In a 10w-40 for example the 10w bit (W = winter, not weight or watt or anything else for that matter) simply means that the oil must have a certain maximum viscosity/flow at low temperature. The lower the ?W? number the better the oils cold temperature/cold start performance.

The 40 in a 10w-40 simply means that the oil must fall within certain viscosity limits at 100 degC. This is a fixed limit and all oils that end in 40 must achieve these limits. Once again the lower the number the thinner the oil, a 30 oil is thinner than a 40 oil at 100 degC etc. Your handbook will specify whether a 30, 40 or 50 etc is required.

SPECIFICATIONS

Specifications are important as these indicate the performance of the oil and whether they have met or passed the latest tests or whether the formulation is effectively obsolete or out of date.
There are two specifications that you should look for on any oil bottle and these are API (American Petroleum Institute) and ACEA (Association des Constructeurs Europeens d?Automobiles) all good oils should contain both of these and an understanding of what they mean is important.

API

This is the more basic as it is split (for passenger cars) into two catagories. S = Petrol and C = Diesel, most oils carry both petrol (S) and diesel (C) specifications.

The following table shows how up to date the specifications the oil are:

PETROL

SG - Introduced 1989 has much more active dispersant to combat black sludge.

SH - Introduced 1993 has same engine tests as SG, but includes phosphorus limit 0.12%, together with control of foam, volatility and shear stability.

SJ - Introduced 1996 has the same engine tests as SG/SH, but phosphorus limit 0.10% together with variation on volatility limits

SL - Introduced 2001, all new engine tests reflective of modern engine designs meeting current emissions standards

SM - Introduced November 2004, improved oxidation resistance, deposit protection and wear protection, also better low temperature performance over the life of the oil compared to previous categories.

Note:

All specifications prior to SL are now obsolete and although suitable for some older vehicles are more than 10 years old and do not provide the same level of performance or protection as the more up to date SL and SM specifications.

DIESEL

CD - Introduced 1955, international standard for turbo diesel engine oils for many years, uses single cylinder test engine only

CE - Introduced 1984, improved control of oil consumption, oil thickening, piston deposits and wear, uses additional multi cylinder test engines

CF4 - Introduced 1990, further improvements in control of oil consumption and piston deposits, uses low emission test engine

CF - Introduced 1994, modernised version of CD, reverts to single cylinder low emission test engine. Intended for certain indirect injection engines

CF2 - Introduced 1994, defines effective control of cylinder deposits and ring face scuffing, intended for 2 stroke diesel engines

CG4 - Introduced 1994, development of CF4 giving improved control of piston deposits, wear, oxidation stability and soot entrainment. Uses low sulphur diesel fuel in engine tests

CH4 - Introduced 1998, development of CG4, giving further improvements in control of soot related wear and piston deposits, uses more comprehensive engine test program to include low and high sulphur fuels

CI4 Introduced 2002, developed to meet 2004 emission standards, may be used where EGR ( exhaust gas recirculation ) systems are fitted and with fuel containing up to 0.5 % sulphur. May be used where API CD, CE, CF4, CG4 and CH4 oils are specified.

Note:

All specifications prior to CH4 are now obsolete and although suitable for some older vehicles are more than 10 years old and do not provide the same level of performance or protection as the more up to date CH4 & CI4 specifications.

If you want a better more up to date oil specification then look for SL, SM, CH4, CI4

ACEA

This is the European equivalent of API (US) and is more specific in what the performance of the oil actually is. A = Petrol, B = Diesel and C = Catalyst compatible or low SAPS (Sulphated Ash, Phosphorus and Sulphur).

Unlike API the ACEA specs are split into performance/application catagories as follows:

A1 Fuel economy petrol
A2 Standard performance level (now obsolete)
A3 High performance and/or extended drain
A4 Reserved for future use in certain direct injection engines
A5 Combines A1 fuel economy with A3 performance

B1 Fuel economy diesel
B2 Standard performance level (now obsolete)
B3 High performance and/or extended drain
B4 For direct injection car diesel engines
B5 Combines B1 fuel economy with B3/B4 performance

C1-04 Petrol and Light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 low SAPS, two way catalyst compatible.
C2-04 Petrol and light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 mid SAPS, two way catalyst compatible.
C3-04 Petrol and light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 mid SAPS, two way catalyst compatible, Higher performance levels due to higher HTHS.

Note: SAPS = Sulphated Ash, Phosphorous and Sulphur.

Put simply, A3/B3, A5/B5 and C3 oils are the better quality, stay in grade performance oils.

APPROVALS

Many oils mention various OEM?s on the bottle, the most common in the UK being VW, MB or BMW but do not be misled into thinking that you are buying a top oil because of this.

Oil Companies send their oils to OEM?s for approval however some older specs are easily achieved and can be done so with the cheapest of mineral oils. Newer specifications are always more up to date and better quality/performance than the older ones.

Some of the older OEM specifications are listed here and depending on the performance level of your car are best ignored if you are looking for a quality high performance oil:

VW ? 500.00, 501.00 and 505.00

Later specs like 503, 504, 506 and 507 are better performing more up to date oils

MB ? 229.1

Later specs like 229.3 and 229.5 are better performing more up to date oils.

BMW ? LL98

Later specs like LL01 and LL04 are better performing more up to date oils.

FINALLY

Above is the most accurate guidance I can give without going into too much depth however there is one final piece of advice regarding the labelling.

Certain statements are made that are meaningless and just marketing blurb, here are a few to avoid!

Recommended for use where?????
May be used where the following specifications apply?????
Approved by?????????..(but with no qualification)
Recommended/Approved by (some famous person, these endorsements are paid for)
Racing/Track formula (but with no supporting evidence)

Also be wary of statements like ?synthetic blend? if you are looking for a fully synthetic oil as this will merely be a semi-synthetic.

Like everything in life, you get what you pay for and the cheaper the oil the cheaper the ingredients and lower the performance levels.

If you want further advice then please feel free to ask here or contact us through our website at http://www.opieoils.co.uk.

Cheers
Simon

END OF QUOTE

I hope that this is not `too detailed` to be of interest - I thought that We might be able to refer to it in future.

Although it seems that We agree that the optimum Engine Oil for our Xtrails is 5W-40 Fully Synthetic - which unfortunately I do NOT now have after the Nissan Main Dealer Service Centre `Value Service` / Oil change.

I now have Nissan 5W-30 Fully Synthetic.


Regards,

Chris
 
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